Brogan, our Marketing Manager, booked a teams with Sally Mitchell, Development Group Manager for H&B Buying Group to have a chat with her about her career in the Construction Industry. The chat was recorded and transcribed to give you an insight in her experience being a women in the industry.
Full transcription is below.
Brogan Neve
Excellent, right.
Right, so just to start things off, can you tell me a little bit about yourself and your current role?
Sally Mitchell
Yeah, so I’ve recently joined the HMB buying group. So I’m looking after all the gateway members, which are like the smaller merchants to help them grow and transition into the main membership. So I’m sort of out there analysing their business with my skills from previous roles to help them grow and to get to the next level and the benefits of joining the main membership. So yeah, it’s early days, but yeah, it’s going well.
Brogan Neve
Yeah, you’re enjoying it?
Sally Mitchell
Yeah, yeah, no, it’s good. Yeah, yeah, it’s a nice mixture between like my supplier background and my merchant background. So I can, yeah, sort of go in there and yeah, see where they need help really, which is good.
Brogan Neve
Excellent. It’s good you’re enjoying something.
Sally Mitchell
Yeah, oh yeah, no, definitely. Yeah, no, it’s good. And all product categories as well, I suppose that’s the other key thing. So rather than just like timber and joinery, it’s every construction product you can imagine. So there’s lots of learning to be done, but it’s good.
Brogan Neve
It’s gonna keep you busy then, yeah.
Sally Mitchell
Yeah, yeah, oh yeah, no, definitely.
Brogan Neve
Perfect. So how long have you been in the construction/building materials industry?
Sally Mitchell
So I just went back and checked actually and it’s 2005 I joined. So yeah, 21 years. But yeah, it’s incredible really. When you look at it, you think, blimey, it’s yeah, time’s gone quick. So I started at William T Eden’s in the timber industry.
Brogan Neve
Wow.
Sally Mitchell
That was my first job out of university as a graduate. So yeah, that’s where I started selling sheet materials to joiners and cabinet makers.
Brogan Neve
Yeah.
So I know obviously you’ve just said that that was your first role coming out of uni, but what led you into your current role?
Sally Mitchell
Just opportunity more than anything. So yeah, as I’ve kind of gone like sort of progressed through roles, I’ve taken the opportunities and I was supplier side and moved into the commercial role for merchants. And then this role came up and with my background, that’s yeah, how I how I got the position.
So yeah, I haven’t kind of moved jobs intentionally. I’ve been asked to move and then there’s been a benefit for moving. So yeah, I’ve kind of grown within the industry.
Brogan Neve
Yeah.
Yeah.
Was this an industry you ever imagined yourself working in?
Sally Mitchell
No, not at all. Yeah, no, I didn’t think I’d be in the timber industry at all. And yeah, my younger sister, she used to just tell people that I sold wood, not completely understanding the complexity of the products.
But to some people, a piece of wood is a piece of wood, but it’s yeah, it’s not like that at all. So yeah, but yeah, I really enjoy the industry. And when I first started at Eden’s, somebody said to me, once you’re in it, you’ll never leave. And that is really true. So yeah, yeah. But yeah, everyone’s nice in the industry as well, and everyone’s there to help you. And I think that’s the key thing really.
Brogan Neve
I know.
Yeah.
Sally Mitchell
People just get on, even if it’s competitors.
Brogan Neve
Yeah, I know, they are. I’ve actually seen a post on LinkedIn of two people that they were competitors and they turned up to the same place at the same time and they were like, oh, it’s all right, don’t worry.
Sally Mitchell
Yeah, yeah, no, it’s business, isn’t it? At the end of the day. So it’s, yeah, I’ve been in those situations on both sides. And yeah, you’ve just got to understand your product and go out there and yeah, promote it at the end of the day and believe in it. That’s the key thing.
Brogan Neve
Yeah.
Yeah.
What do you think that this industry could do to attract and retain more women?
Sally Mitchell
I think it’s changed massively since when I first started. So when I was in the industry, there was hardly any women at all. And then when I used to go to the award evenings, there would be a handful of women in the room, but it’s definitely probably say 70-30 now.
So I think it’s naturally attracted more women in the industry and people sort of taking the opportunities. I think that’s kind of the key thing.
And with, I think marketing’s a big thing too, like there’s more interest in the product than just a piece of wood.
Brogan Neve
Yeah.
Yeah, no, because so my other half, he’s like a builder and jack of all trades. He hates it when I say that. But because he’d started just fitting bathrooms and now he’s doing all the extensions and like, I can be like, oh, we’re recruiting for X, Y and Z. He’s like,
No way, I’ve just used their product. I was like, I’ve literally never even heard of them. Like how? And because obviously the marketing of all of these products have become so vast. It’s, I don’t know, and it’s like, well, we renovated our first home and now looking back at the pictures, I’m like, oh, I know that company or
Oh, I know someone that works at that company and…
Sally Mitchell
Yeah, I think that’s the biggest thing, like, and even the names actually mean something in the industry now. Whereas like back in the day, when it was William T Eden, you wouldn’t really know what they did. But now, as it’s been bought out, it’s now Maria Timber. So you know, it’s a timber company. So yeah, I think marketing is a big thing and branding as well.
Sally Mitchell
Definitely.
Brogan Neve
I know you’ve said the people, but what is it that you enjoy the most about working in this sector?
Sally Mitchell
I think it’s the fact, like I said, that everyone’s there to help. So when I’ve been sort of on buying group boards, everybody shares their knowledge with you and they want you to succeed within the industry. And everyone’s similar kind of temperament as well, but we just get on, that’s sort of the key thing.
Brogan Neve
Yeah.
Sally Mitchell
Yeah, that’s what I’ve stayed in it, to be honest. And like I say, it’s all the opportunities that I’ve had where people want to help you and see your expertise and that, oh, do you want to come work for us and this is what you can do and sort of learn a new role. I think that’s, yeah, that’s what’s kept me here at the end of the day.
Brogan Neve
Yeah.
Sally Mitchell
And the products too, because it’s vast, isn’t it? There’s just so much out there that, yeah, you’re never going to know everything, but the more you know, the more, the better you become.
Brogan Neve
Yeah.
What skills or qualities do you think that women bring to the industry that are sometimes overlooked?
Sally Mitchell
That’s A tricky one. I think, yeah, just having a group of men and a lady being there is just a different, like people look, it’s a different atmosphere. And I think probably the more, the marketing side as well, like looking at a product and making the outside world understand what that product does. So from a, it’s quite sexist in a way, we have all to say, but from a male perspective, they’ve, a lot of them have been brought up with the materials and they know what they’re used for. But I think a lady coming into the business, it’s analysing the product and how you can sell it better and explaining what it is and what the use is. So yeah, it’s just a different angle. We’re just, yeah, yeah. So
Brogan Neve
Yeah.
Yeah, completely. Yeah, completely. What advice, oh sorry, what advice would you give to a young woman considering a career in this industry?
Sally Mitchell
I’d just say take every opportunity that you get. So yeah, everyone’s there to help you. And if you’re going in one direction, an opportunity comes up and you want to move, take it. That’s sort of how I’ve progressed through the industry. And if I hadn’t have taken those opportunities, I’d probably still be where I was from the beginning.
Brogan Neve
Yeah
Sally Mitchell
So I think that’s the key thing. It depends, it’s different stages of life, isn’t it? And what comes up at what time. But for me, that’s the key thing. I’m really understanding the product. That’s sort of what’s got me through. So when I’ve moved into new product categories, understanding the technicalities to be able to go out there and sell.
because it is hard. People assume you don’t know the product, but as soon as you give them technical information, they sort of buy into you and know what you know what you’re talking about. That’s sort of the key thing really. Yeah, yeah. I think, yeah, for me, that’s the main thing is just like, I’ve done quite a few roles, but it is, and I say that to my daughter now, so she’s come up to 16 and trying to work out what A-levels to do.
And I just said to her, do what you enjoy and you just have to, you literally have to take the opportunities. So yeah, it’s taking, sometimes you’re taking the chance, aren’t you, to move to the next level, but it pays off. Like that’s the key thing. And you make it what you want at the end of the day. So that’s always my advice to her.
Brogan Neve
Yeah.
Sally Mitchell
And timber can be interesting.
Brogan Neve
It’s not just selling wood.
Sally Mitchell
It’s not boring. No, no, no, no, that’s the thing. And I think once you get into the industry, it’s nice to talk about the products with like-minded people, because in the outside world, you just get a funny look.
Brogan Neve
Yeah.
Yeah, because if you were to turn around to someone, like say your sister for example, and she’d be like, oh, so what is it that you do? Like, oh, I sell wood.
Sally Mitchell
People just move on. But yeah, once you get into the technicalities, it’s, yeah, it is interesting and it’s, yeah, it’s a job. Like everything, you make it what you want it to be, don’t you? But it is a nice industry to be in.
Brogan Neve
Yeah.
No, I get that.
Yeah.
Yeah. If you could give your younger self a piece of career advice, what would you give?
Sally Mitchell
That’s a hard one.
I’d probably say…
moving too soon. That would be my, that was my biggest regret. So going from a timber background to all products within a few years.
learning that amount of products was really, really hard. You have to sort of go back. So I went straight into the sales for all products and I should have gone behind the trade counter to actually learn the product and the brand and know what it was rather than going out there trying to sell it. So I then went back. to a product range that I can actually learn and understand and go out and sell it. That’s the only thing I’d change in my career.
Brogan Neve
Yeah.
I mean, you threw yourself in the deep end there, didn’t you?
Sally Mitchell
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, literally. So yeah, I think maybe nowadays it might be a bit different, but back then it was you really needed to go out there and find and know what you, yeah, what you were selling at the end of the day.
Brogan Neve
And last question is, what’s one achievement in your career so far that you are particularly proud of?
Sally Mitchell
So I would say doing both sides of the fence, so being supplier side and being merchant side. So it is very, very different and it took a long time to move from supplier to merchant. But once you understand both sides, it really has sort of helped me flourished. So I would say that was my biggest achievement because it was a big step moving from supplier to sort of the commercial merchant side and not having any training, literally just learning on the job. But once I got it, that’s sort of my biggest achievement and has helped me progressed even further in my career.
Brogan Neve
No, that sounds good. So that is all of the questions that I wanted to ask you.
Sally Mitchell
My other half, he works in hair and beauty. So he’s hair and beauty and I’m timber. We’ve like switched roles.
Brogan Neve
PH.
Yeah.
But that’s good because then it also shows, it’ll show your daughter as well, but like not one industry is suited to one person and not one role is suited to a male or a female. So yeah.
Sally Mitchell
Oh yeah, massively, yeah. Yeah, that’s the thing, isn’t it? And it was, obviously, careful what I say, but it was very male dominated, but like back when I started massively. And it is changing and there are those opportunities. And I think even like online, isn’t it? Like all the e-commerce nowadays, you have to be out there and you have to have your brand to be fighting.
Brogan Neve
Yeah.
Sally Mitchell
So, because that’s the next generation, that’s why I always say everything is online, isn’t it?
Brogan Neve
Yeah, yeah, it’s mad.
Sally Mitchell
Yeah, scary. Taking over the world.
Brogan Neve
Honestly, I’m still getting to grips with some of the apps and it’s, I mean, I’m 28, so it’s obviously I’ve grown up with it, but I’ve also, I knew the life without it. So it’s still juggling everything.
Sally Mitchell
Yes.
Yeah, see, I’m still old school and then my job’s like, Mum, you need to use this and you need to use that. And why are you doing it that way? This is a quicker way. So yeah, she’s teaching me. So yeah, it’s quite funny. I’ve just got an iPhone now, so I’m learning the way.
Brogan Neve
Yeah.
Yeah, no, it’s good.
Sally Mitchell
Yeah, when I first started, there wasn’t even a sat nav. So I literally had a box of A to Z maps in the back of my car and then had to go and find the road to work how to get there. Yeah.
Brogan Neve
No, I can’t do that. No, I cannot use a map to save my life.
Sally Mitchell
Yeah, no, it’s mad. And you just think how much it’s changed. It’s massive, but yeah, it’s good. I think that’s the thing. It just keeps changing, doesn’t it, and evolving and you have to keep up with it at the end of the day. So, but yeah, no, I’m like, obviously I’ve been for H&B. Yeah, was it just over two months now, but I’m really enjoying it.
So yeah, it’s good. It’s nice going from a big company to a smaller company too, not realising what you actually know.
Brogan Neve
Yeah.
Yeah.
Sally Mitchell
That’s one of the big things that I found. So yeah, no, it’s good. Live and breathe.
Brogan Neve
Good. It’s, yeah, I’m glad you’re enjoying it. It makes us feel better as well.
Sally Mitchell
Yeah, oh yeah, no, massively. I was just super lucky it came up at the right time because I left on the Friday and then National Timber Group went into administration on the Tuesday. So I was super lucky.
So yeah, but no, yeah, no, it’s good. So, but yeah, if there’s anything else you want me to add in or any other background, just let us know and then go from there. I’m around like a couple of days a week at home. The rest of the time I’m out and about, so.
Brogan Neve
Thanks again for doing all this and have a good day
Sally Mitchell
Yeah you too, have a good one, bye
